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-   -   Rotorhead87's Cosmo 13B-RE FC3S build-up (https://rotarycarclub.com/showthread.php?t=4313)

87 t-66 10-13-2008 04:50 PM

nice

rotorhead87 10-17-2008 08:44 AM

While I was saving up throughout the months passing by, the 13B-RE that I bought blowned up was in the process of being rebuilt. During those times all I could think was "Damn, is it really gonna be worth dumping all this money on my car!" I figured I would go ahead and stick to that old saying of "If your going to do it, do it right the first time." It makes sense to the common mind. There is also another neat saying using the words: Cheap, Reliable, Fast you can only have two out of the three.

I saw this somewhere a long time ago I thought it was really true:
- You can have a car that is Cheap and Reliable, but it isn't gonna be Fast
- You can have a car that is Fast and built very Cheap, but sure isn't Reliable
- You can have a car that is Fast and Reliable, but sure the hell isn't Cheap!!

Okay enough with the sayings. I had the bought brand new seals, gaskets, fittings, etc for a complete rebuild. The new FD3S rotor housings I bought got their exhaust ports opened up a bit, water jacket modification, machined for pinning. As for the steels they were relapped, machined for pinning, and of course given a large streetport. I had 6 extra 12a dowel pins put into the motor. Since emissions is of not concern to Florida, anything to do with helping the environment is gone. I had the oil metering pump removed because I just couldn't trust something so old and very expensive to do it's job on my new motor. As for the UIM and LIM I had them port matched and smoothen all the runners alot <---actually required alot of welding. Lets just say if I were to shine a flash light into a runner, you would be able to see a tad bit of the actual light source. Alright lets get to the pictures. Sorry everyone, I cannot post pictures of the porting and pinning by request of my builder.

Polished eccetric shaft
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/3079/dcp0258fv0.jpg

S5 rotors with OEM 2mm 2-piece apex seals, also double sprunged
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/9579/dcp0257ly1.jpg

The upper intake manifold before and after. Do you see what I mean about alot of welding.
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/8...9061510ii4.jpghttp://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4...9061509nt4.jpg
http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/1751/dcp0325qw0.jpghttp://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5...3060720vq7.jpg

The lower intake manifold before and after.
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/6958/dcp0276fs3.jpg
after having all the excess aluminum removed
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/6...5061247nb8.jpg
Lastly polished
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/6205/dcp0267el3.jpg

And last the pinned,ported, polished bastardized motor composed of piece from all the other generations...my Cosmo 13B-RE block.
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/1...9061328df3.jpghttp://img363.imageshack.us/img363/8...9061329rz3.jpg

Since the FD rotor housings were brand new it would be a great chance to do anything to assist the motor in cooling. So I had the Water Jacket modification done at the shop. Exactly like this picture from racingbeat's website. Here's their explaination of the modification for those who wonder why:

"The Rotor Housing Water Jacket Modification is intended to improve cooling in the hot zone of the rotor housing to increase both housing and seal life. This modification involves cutting grooves in the water jacket in the vicinity of the leading and trailing spark plugs to increase heat transfer out of the housing inner surface. The modification can be performed on a new rotor housing, and is only appropriate for race and the most extreme street use."

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/964/11488qf2.jpg

rotorhead87 10-18-2008 02:43 PM

Yeah...I know that the block looks assembled on the table. I just had the housings all put together just to get a glimpse of what it looks like. You get the idea!

WE3RX7 10-20-2008 07:01 PM

Looking good - very similar color choice for my block.

Who did the polishing on the manifolds or were they just dipped?

rotorhead87 10-21-2008 06:31 PM

I actually did the polishing myself...not the best polishing job in the world but good enough to my standards. I don't believe I did too bad for a first timer with a full time college schedule.

WE3RX7 10-21-2008 08:20 PM

I guess I'm slightly confused on the welding though - did you cut it apart to smooth out the interior and then weld it all together again? What are your thoughts on the gains that would make?

I dont plan to go to that extreme on my RE but power output should still easily make 425whp...

SpooledupRacing 10-21-2008 09:18 PM

couple questions..

Who polished your e-shaft and how much or did u polish that to?

Double sprung apex seals.. u mean u have 2 large and small springs behind your apex seals.. what purpose does that serve and is it something that is known to be good to do?

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WE3RX7 (Post 53713)
I guess I'm slightly confused on the welding though - did you cut it apart to smooth out the interior and then weld it all together again? What are your thoughts on the gains that would make?

I dont plan to go to that extreme on my RE but power output should still easily make 425whp...

Your right...The manifold had several areas cut out to smoothen the interior and decrease air turbulance that could potential disrupt the smooth air flow that were aiming for. Also cuts allowed access where the dremel couldn't reach through the main opening. My fabricator also widened the degree of curvature in the primary runners to smoothen the air flow. If you look into your manifold,in some area, there are large bumps (thick areas of the manifold) those areas were also ground down. Over here at the shop my fabricator has done it to an FD manifold. I believe it's an awesome modification though it required a ton of work, it has been already tested on a 13B-REW. At first the FD has a T78 turbo, streetport and stock UIM and LIM it put down 311rwhp @ 11psi on a dynojet. After being port matched and having what was done similar to my UIM, the FD was redynoed to 342rwhp at 11psi.

That's awesome that your setup will be in the 400's, I'm hoping to be in that power range with my setup.

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpooledupRacing (Post 53729)
couple questions..

Who polished your e-shaft and how much or did u polish that to?

Double sprung apex seals.. u mean u have 2 large and small springs behind your apex seals.. what purpose does that serve and is it something that is known to be good to do?

My fabricator (JR) at JR Fabrication and Performance did the polishing of the eccetric shaft. I don't know an exact price on polishing it because it just a standard of his to sit all parts in parts cleaner and haing everything as clean as possible for every build, but I can ask if you would like. I honestly think it wouldn't cost a whole lot because he just places it on his lathe machine and gets them done real quick.

lol Thats what I meaning to say about the double sprung apex seals...your right. Let me get back to you regarding the purpose of the double springs that way I don't put wrong information out there for you and other readers out there.

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 03:49 PM

Okay I spoke with my builder and the reason for the double sprung apex seal is because while under boost the strength of the extra spring will allow for a better seal to conteract the stress it is experiencing.

RotaryXperiment 10-22-2008 05:26 PM

who is building your motor if u dont mind me asking?
looking good btw!

Phoenix7 10-22-2008 05:37 PM

cool build...you learn something new everyday. Keep it up man!

Can't wait to see what gains you get from all your mods.

djmtsu 10-22-2008 05:49 PM

This car is going to be retarded fast.

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RotaryXperiment (Post 53907)
who is building your motor if u dont mind me asking?
looking good btw!

Thanks!

JR Fabrication & Performance
1718 SW Biltmore Street
Port Saint Lucie, FL 34984
(772)343-0510
Builder/Fabricator: JR Shoun

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix7 (Post 53909)
cool build...you learn something new everyday. Keep it up man!

Can't wait to see what gains you get from all your mods.

Thanks alot! I've got alot more interesting modifications to post up I just don't want to spoil them right now. So stay tuned. Another thing about the double sprunged apex seal that may make sense in my mind is that after long period of time that extra support would help rather than a single spring being wore out after all stress given to it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by djmtsu (Post 53916)
This car is going to be retarded fast.

I hope so, only time will tell................................:dunno:

SpooledupRacing 10-22-2008 06:44 PM

Now is there 2 big AND 2 little springs? or do u use 1 of each and just ad 1 more big or 1 more little one as a "helper"

I get the idea just curious how this works

looks great keep it up buddy.

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 07:16 PM

Oh man....I don't know if I can recall the past that well, it been a loooong time since I had that motor put together. LoL...Sorry! let me get back to you on that question too. I want to say two large springs and one small one, but don't take my word for it until I get back to you asap.

SpooledupRacing 10-22-2008 07:20 PM

and if u can get me a price on the polish of the e-shaft that would be cool, I would love to send mine out to get polished.

rotorhead87 10-22-2008 07:50 PM

No problem I'll do that for you as soon as possible.

WE3RX7 10-22-2008 09:47 PM

If you get a chance after the build to swap out for a stock UIM/LIM, I'd love to see the difference you get with all that work, 20+whp is worth it for sure, especially if it means you can achieve that level at lower boost...

rotorhead87 10-23-2008 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WE3RX7 (Post 53979)
If you get a chance after the build to swap out for a stock UIM/LIM, I'd love to see the difference you get with all that work, 20+whp is worth it for sure, especially if it means you can achieve that level at lower boost...

You know I should do that because I have another RE motor sitting at the shop. I know for sure there's gonna be a difference because with all the port matching and changing the flow of air it'll be like try to breath with a straw after running a mile. Actually right now my other friend who has the same except setup in a 10th anny, but minus the streetport, UIM/LIM port matching, FD housings & TB. He put down I believe 303rwhp@10psi on a mustang dyno with a crappy tune.Oh I also forgot to mention both the 10th anny and the T78 FD let off on the dyno at 7500rpms.

SpooledupRacing 10-23-2008 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorhead87 (Post 53959)
No problem I'll do that for you as soon as possible.


No hurry at all but when u do that would be awsome if u could relay the price I may send some business his way then :)

GREAT build I love the way u are going at it looks real good keep it up!

rotorhead87 10-23-2008 09:28 AM

I figured it's time for a small update everyone! Well since everything is now assembled and all the machining and porting done, it was time to see how this power plant is going to look like. I was so happy to see it all together that day. The motor looked so good, it was beyond what I was expecting. Many people complimented on the motor that it came to a point where the shop just had to cover it up and hide it because just some people had that certain look in their eyes. It was basically looking at a $8,000 piece of fine machinery on a engine stand ready to roll out of the shop anytime. Anyways as you all know the Cosmo 13B-RE is not a simple drop-in and bolt up motor. JR Fabrication & Performance made me some custom chromoly motor mounts to hold this beast down in my FC.

Here are some pictures of the motor all put together.
http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/8...0061522eq9.jpg
http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/8...0061521ld9.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/6...0061529la3.jpg

Here are those custom Chromoly motor mounts:

This mount is on the oil filter side. It mounted onto an aluminum plate...lol yeah that too was polished.
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/1...0061519ia5.jpg

This is the turbo side motor mount. It's a pretty damn solid mount.
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/8...8061415qf7.jpg

RotaryXperiment 10-26-2008 01:04 PM

which oil pan are u gonna use?

SpooledupRacing 10-26-2008 01:51 PM

dude i just wanted to say WOW.... very nice.

StreetRx7 10-26-2008 04:06 PM

Banzai Racing sells these mounts for cosmo into FC an for 3RD Gen Motor into FC....

Great build by the way.. I did one about 7 months ago...
With Haltech E6X,1000cc 1600cc injectors,1x walbro, hks manifold, ACT clutch, hugh front mount, an T04E Turbo .81ar stock rebuild... Runs great...

rotorhead87 10-26-2008 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RotaryXperiment (Post 54774)
which oil pan are u gonna use?

The original oil pan that went with the Cosmo motor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpooledupRacing (Post 54778)
dude i just wanted to say WOW.... very nice.

Thanks! I hoping to get the same response when she running one of these day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StreetRx7 (Post 54801)
Banzai Racing sells these mounts for cosmo into FC an for 3RD Gen Motor into FC....

Great build by the way.. I did one about 7 months ago...
With Haltech E6X,1000cc 1600cc injectors,1x walbro, hks manifold, ACT clutch, hugh front mount, an T04E Turbo .81ar stock rebuild... Runs great...

Yeah I was just about to buy a set from them, but then my fabricator said that he'll just build me a custom chromoly/aluminum cosmo motor mounts...so whatever floats my boat, I'm very much happy with how they turned out.

That setup sounds badass. An other client had a setup somewhat exactly like your but with a 13B-REW and good coilover set. That car was an awesome auto-x car putting shame on those expensive hooked up porsches and corvettes. Do you happen to have any pics of you ride, I'd love to catch a glimpse of it? Thanks for the compliment also!

WE3RX7 10-26-2008 09:11 PM

Good progress man - I cant wait to see it settled into the new home...

rotorhead87 10-29-2008 09:58 PM

I think I'm gonna do a new update for everyone! Since I just graduated from Indian River State College this month with an Associate Degee in Nursing I'm officially one test away from getting my Registered Nurse license WooHOO. Well I'm here bored off my ass so I figured hell why not give you all some more eye candy. This will be pretty interesting to many of you but its all pretty cool. Check it out and enjoy!

Nothing special here I just wanted to show off the stock 13B-RE pulleys repainted to a graphite color.
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/3...0061528lr9.jpg

Here is a custom polished secondary fuel rail built by JR Fabrication & Performance and if you look just underneathe it is the primary fuel rail from a FD motor. The FD3S primary fuel rail was modified to fit the 13B-RE block. As for my injectors I am running Marren 1600cc top-feed injectors for the secondaries and Blitz 850cc side-feed injectors for the primaries.
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/4...0061527js8.jpg

This is a special piece I found really cool because I was able to see JR Fabrication & Performance make it from a chunk of solid 3" aluminum bar to this beautiful fuel Y-Block. It's mounted onto a custom aluminum bracket underneathe the UIM. As you can also notice the two painted silver bars, in the first picture, are placed to support the UIM.
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/5...2061638uz1.jpg

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/9...2061637js9.jpg

And last....my LS1 coils I got off an 01' Chevy Camaro SS they were basically brand new and best of all free. A previous client of the shop worked for a chevy dealership and they would end up throwing away perfectly good parts everyday. Anyways as you can see I have them mounted to the motor; reason is to decrease the amount of resistance by significantly shortening the wire distance from coils to spark plugs. Matter of fact they lay on the same bracket the Y-Block rests on. As for ignition wires I'm using the red MSD 8.5mm for a Chevy Silverado 1500 (not pictured).
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/6...0061526ov6.jpg

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/8...0061525fs7.jpg

I hope everyone is enjoying what I have so far...Feel free to drop a line everyone. Thanks for viewing, I have much more to show!!!

sk8world 10-29-2008 10:48 PM

If you are going for big numbers and want to flow air thru the plenum nicely you may want to have the RE upper mani cut open and grind out the plates that direct air off the TB. I will attach a pic for you.

sk8world 10-29-2008 10:50 PM

re upper
 
1 Attachment(s)
here you go

SpooledupRacing 10-30-2008 04:44 AM

Just remember this...

Coils hate 2 things.. vibrations and heat... with them mounted to the engine they will get JUST THAT..

Mount them to the firewall and safe the life of your coils.. trust me I sell coils for SAABS and VW's all day long... all of which are mounted directly on the engine..

I think even the FD guys want to move the coils away from the engine.. and any "gain" you think u may get from having them so close really wont be a gain at all.. plug wires are one of the LEAST hp related items for an engine.

Looks great..

rotorhead87 10-30-2008 07:19 AM

Thanks for the advice Spooledup. My other friend who has a 10th ann'y has the same exact coil set up and 13B-RE motor. So far his car has been running as a DD for alittle bit over a year and not a problem has occurred yet. Hopefully nothing goes wrong anytime soon.

rotorhead87 10-30-2008 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sk8world (Post 55700)
If you are going for big numbers and want to flow air thru the plenum nicely you may want to have the RE upper mani cut open and grind out the plates that direct air off the TB. I will attach a pic for you.

I didn't have the UIM cut directly like the picture you provided. I had section from each side and bottom of the UIM to allow access to the grinder to level out all the high spots inside of the manifold. The entire inside of the UIM and LIM manifold is smoothen for better air flow.

sk8world 10-30-2008 09:45 AM

sounds very nice. With a real tuner it should make a ton of HP!

rotorhead87 11-04-2008 08:03 AM

New update for today!!!

Well if I can recall the same time that I was still cleaning the engine bay at my friend's garage the motor was sitting on the stand waiting for me to bring it, it's reconditioned home. During the time of waiting JR Fabrication wanted to experiment on just building some stuff for my motor. We were talking about heat shield wrap for the turbo and down pipe one day and a few days JR fabricated a heat shield made from a sheet of stainless steel. Being that my motor was polished and kinda showy in a way...:dunno: I thought about by a polished oil catch-can off ebay just to add that little extra shine to the rest of the motor. Well again I brought this up to JR and he said to not buy that heavy piece of crap off of ebay, I'll just build you one that 10x's better.A couple months before that happened, our hook up at the Chevrolet dealership was collecting aluminum A/C canisters from some recalls, I believe.Anyways at the shop he took two of those small canisters, cut them in half, welded baffles inside, and then welding them together along with necessities to build a oil-catch can.

Here's the custom stainless steel heat shield that blocks direct heat from the turbo and downpipe.
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/3...2061630vu9.jpg

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/8...2061632fw4.jpg

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/4...2061631tf4.jpg

And here is my custom polished oil-catch can bolted onto where the A/C compressor bracket was bolted onto.
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/8...8061202do0.jpg

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/8...8061201gr1.jpg

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1...8061416wm9.jpg

rotorhead87 11-10-2008 09:09 AM

Now since that I had the motor ported along with the manifolds, I might as well go ahead and have a throttle body modification done. If you ever get a chance or have seen the differences between the brass throttle plates of the 13BT and the 13B-REW you'll notice a big difference. The REW TB has two big throttle plates in the secondaries and one small throttle plate in the primary, as for the 13BT all the plates are of similar size to the small plate in the REW TB. As you all know already that I'm trying to flow large amounts of air efficiently to feed the motor. Well any ways here at the shop JRFP started to bore out REW TB primaries to have all matching size plates in the primary and secondaries. The draw back of this modification was that I had to buy two FD TB because I could not find anyone that would sell the same exact size brass plate we were searching for. I ended up buying a good used FD TB from Herblenny and stripped TB from an other FD owner in Gainesville, FL awhile back. With this modification it help with the airflow by probably enhanced the primary size by 30% larger.

Here is the original plate on the left and the new plate installed
http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/2...5061818dd8.jpg

The old plate laying on top of the new one just for you all to see how much the size difference is.
http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/8...5061819oa0.jpg

From the inside
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/343/dcp0290ir0.jpg

The FD throttle body all polished on the outside and the inside.
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/3423/dcp0285gw4.jpg

The the throttle body installed onto the motor.
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7...2061633tv7.jpg

Sorry everyone about the really crappy pictures, but I hope you enjoy.:icon_tup:

RotaryXperiment 11-10-2008 08:40 PM

coming along really nice. now u need some elf/total oil in there ha!

rotorhead87 11-10-2008 09:23 PM

Is that oil any good? Its the first time I've heard of that product brand.

need RX7 11-10-2008 09:50 PM

Comin' along real good. :icon_tup: This thing's gonna be a beast when it's done. :driving:

Teenwolf1393 11-12-2008 03:14 AM

hey rotorhead, looking good . hopefully your motor treats you right

next time im in Port st lucie you gotta give me a ride.


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