Project86- My first (and probably not the last) Rebuild

[WE3RX7]

Look'n good - but now you're going to run into the problem I had. Nice clean engine bay, dirty old everything else. Although it'll clean up nicely! Cant wait to see it in clear!!

[Max777]

Originally Posted by project86

eh sorry i was havin technical difficulties.. ill have the rest up tomorrow. the file sizes were too big and they did nt save the first time.


ttt. are you talking about removing the wiring harness on the drivers side? or somethin else? no offense taken. it didnt take me long to do any of that actually.

Yeah, I totally removed the hanress myself, but it ended up being more of a pain in the ass than it's worth for what I was doing... if you're gonna re-wrap everything, do it after you put the harness back in the car, otherwise your wiring will be all off and not reach where it's supposed to.

[project86]

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray

man I might lose my nut all over your FC...but then you wouldn't be able to find it and clean it up hahahahahahaha. Great Job Kyle!

hahahahahahaha thats true i wouldnt be able to find it... and... well nvm.. haha i dont wanna think about it.

Originally Posted by WE3RX7

Look'n good - but now you're going to run into the problem I had. Nice clean engine bay, dirty old everything else. Although it'll clean up nicely! Cant wait to see it in clear!!

ya know i thought about that and i know someday its gonna get dirty... the damn things always do.. but im gonna pull that other harness out and re wrap i think if its not too much of a pain.

Originally Posted by Max777

Yeah, I totally removed the hanress myself, but it ended up being more of a pain in the ass than it's worth for what I was doing... if you're gonna re-wrap everything, do it after you put the harness back in the car, otherwise your wiring will be all off and not reach where it's supposed to.

noted definitely. thanks for the tip

[project86]

i hate when i run out of quarters for laundry

[FC3S Murray]

hahaha....dirty laundry BUT the car is painted and that is all that matters. Soon you will be living off of Top Ramen BUT you will have that motor.

[chibikougan]

Lookin very nice I will have to make time to get in the Body shop this week.

[project86]

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray

hahaha....dirty laundry BUT the car is painted and that is all that matters. Soon you will be living off of Top Ramen BUT you will have that motor.

hahah sean i already live off of top ramen.

ok.. so i wanna take a poll since you mentioned the engine..... everyday i am leaning more and more towards callin up pineapple racing or kyle mohan at mazdatrix and having either of them just build me a brand new s5 turbo engine because the more and more i think about it i start to realize how damn busy im gonna be this summer (especially if i get hired at avmax painting air planes).
i know you mentioned i could use youre garage sean and kyle has also offered but realistically i dont think the engine is gonna happen this summer if i have to do the piece by piece thing and build it myself. my work hours even i stay at officemax for the summer is going to be an extreme inconvenience as far as gettin the engine built myself. simply because i dont have my own garage to work in at my own pace. so i want an honest opinion from everyone following this thread.
do i quit bitchin', buy the parts one at a time and assemble VERY slowly when its convenient for everyone else.. or do i take out a roughly 5k loan and have someone build it for me that i know wont f*** it up lets hear it!

[project86]

oh and btw.. i got my doors and fenders cut in today so ill be puttin them on the car tomorrow and should be doing complete paint hopefully end of this week beginning of next!

[WE3RX7]

I still say build it yourself! Save up, buy a good (or as good as you can) used core, tear it down, replace what needs replacing and drop it in. You should be able to do all this yourself for under $3k if you get lucky and end up tearing down a block with good rotors and/or good housings.....

[project86]

i really think im gonna buy new housings and irons if i piece it together myself just for piece of mind. but i do like your idea. and i could do what murray did for porting and send the housings and irons off. THANK YOU FOR INPUT!!! WHOS NEXT?!

[TitaniumTT]

I will offer 2 options..... one, buy a core, JDM, blown, whatever, and send it off to CPR. Here's why, Howard says the parts won't cost over $700, and the rebuild rates are reasonable as well. That would be one of the cheapest.

I can rebuild it for you as well, my approach is slightly different than Howards and I have my reasons as I'm sure he has his. Depending on the parts that are needed, I could be cheaper, or I could be more expensive, depends on your core.

Personally, I'm always one to do it myself. The ONLY two things that I haven't done to my car myself were tinting the windows, and installing the front windshield, the windshield was an insurance thing too

Up to you, what are you looking for in terms of power? Have you given any thought to porting? Portmatching? Thermal coatings? Preliminary research on turbo's?

[project86]

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

I will offer 2 options..... one, buy a core, JDM, blown, whatever, and send it off to CPR. Here's why, Howard says the parts won't cost over $700, and the rebuild rates are reasonable as well. That would be one of the cheapest.

I can rebuild it for you as well, my approach is slightly different than Howards and I have my reasons as I'm sure he has his. Depending on the parts that are needed, I could be cheaper, or I could be more expensive, depends on your core.

Personally, I'm always one to do it myself. The ONLY two things that I haven't done to my car myself were tinting the windows, and installing the front windshield, the windshield was an insurance thing too

Up to you, what are you looking for in terms of power? Have you given any thought to porting? Portmatching? Thermal coatings? Preliminary research on turbo's?

im looking for between 350 and 400. give or take i suppose. that will be more than enough to keep me happy. and i want that to the wheels. as far as porting goes it seems to me like an aggressive street port is gonna be what i want. i dont want to lose daily driveability by going more aggressive than street port. as far as thermal coatings? im lost there (noooob sometimes). and i already have a turbo. stock s5 that im gonna have bnr rebuild.
and like a said. i would love to build my self but at this point in time it just seems like it would be too large of an inconvenience. and one more thing. i have never heard of CPR

[WE3RX7]

350whp and driveability, sounds like another RE candidate, lol...

Honestly though, 400whp is pushing it on a BNR turbo IMHO. Its not impossible, but not just a bolt on and go situation... look at what Brian had to push to get over 400whp with his (stock I think) twins and his motor is S W E E T.

I dont recall and am too lazy to go back earlier in the thread, but is the idea to use a stock harness/ecu with an RTEK? If it is, and that 400whp is truly your goal, you wont make it with that setup... 400whp on a streetport S5 will need standalone and most likely a bigger turbo (not sure how big BNR is going these days, but the 60-1 seems to be the norm).

As an example, one of the guys I used to hang out with and cruise with had an S5 streetported (fairly aggressive) running the BNR 60-1 and made 343whp at 12psi conservatively with an LT10 microtech tuned by Steve Kan. Most guys that run these setups fall in and around that area. 2gslse with his FD (REW block) using the RX6 turbo is making 360ish whp (MC - correct me on the boost setting, but I think it was 14) on a very mildly ported motor running a power FC.

All I'm getting at is REALLY plan out the power adders and supporting EMS when looking for that 400whp magic. 350-375 is doable with the 60-1, but the question is for how long? Both guys mentioned above have been reliably driving their cars for more than three years now... I just hate pushing parts to their limits, just something to consider....

[TitaniumTT]

I agree with Bill, yes the BNR's can get to that level, but using the S5 turbo is really pushing it to it's limits. To me, anything over 350/375 and you really need to start looking at components that alot of people wouldn't think to look at changing to get to 400.

As for the porting, I would shy away from an agressive streetport, if you want to keep the driveability manners, I would only give the intake ports a little tickle and not change the timing very much at all, in fact, I wouldn't change the opening at all. I WOULD port the exhaust, however I wouldn't change the closing. Basically, I wouldn't change the factories overlap at all.

I would look at other turbo's too, GT35R of course comes to mind with some of the TO4's etc etc, and anything over 350 I think the stock mani is really choking the engine and the turbo. I have the data to support that on the factory twins and I suspect it to be similar on the S4/5 mani's as well.

Here's what I would do, I would do it in stages. You obviously need an engine, turbo, intercooler, ecu.

If you have an ECU and a harness, than I would run the girl pretty much bone stock until you have the coin/time to upgrade things. With an Rtek, I wouldn't go farther than upping the exhaust, and intercooler, and I would certaily spend some time on the dyno pulling some timing out and getting the L's dialed in. I wouldn't do anything farther than a BNR on an Rtek and I would figure out a way to log EMAP too. I would do this to make sure that you're not pushing the turbo too hard, or choking the engine.

Next step is prep for more ponies. This would include fuel, ignition, intercooler and ECU. Keep in mind at this point you're still running a pretty stock ECU but you'll be able to get the most out of the setup. For an ECU, MoTeC all the way, take a look at the M2R as you can get into one of those for slightly more than a haltech/microtech, but of course I would rec one of the M"hundred" series becuase of the software, it's just incredible.

So now you've got a cherry engine, all the supporting mods in place, it's time for the ponies - tubular mani and a real turbo.

It may take you a year or two to get there, but you'll do it safer, and you'll have a more reliable setup at the end of the day, as opposed to a setup that is constantly pushed to it's very limits

[FC3S Murray]

I am speaking here HONESTLY......after having dealt with as much BS as I have the last three years in regards to chasing the "400" goal I cant help but admit that I sometimes I just wish I would have stayed at my last 300HP motor. That son-of-a-bitch was reliable(besides my Oil Pressure issue) and I beat on it all the time. True it wasn't the fastest BUT the amount of work I have invested and MULTIPLE hic-ups/ unexpected parts that have come up just to get my motor where it is today............at times doesn't seem worth it.

Granted I don't know what this current motor is gonna put down NOR how long it is going to last (hense why I am spending soooo much time researching conservative IGN L set-ups, fuel mapping and multiple failsafes both mechanical and electrical) AT least I can say I know if this motor fails it will be my hand since I know every part inside and out. Perfect example of this is look at my last motor AND Matt's current motor situation....it blows but goes to show if you get it built, get it done by a true credible company that stands by their word


Kyle what I recommend is you think long and hard about what you want. Research, research, RESEARCH multiple set-ups and keep in mind reliability rarely comes with ultra high performance.
You are a smart guy so what you decide will most likely be legit. My second child is due AUG 8th SOOO if you want to build or have the means to do it, give me a call.



BTW..if you do go stand alone, do what Brian says. I would have gone MoTec if I would have seen what it is capable of after seeing Brian's software. That shit is as good as the Pratt and Whitney Turbine Engine test cell managment system we use up on the hill.